TV Home Setups

[Steve in Pudsey]

I appreciate that, my point was simply that getting 64kbps performance from a connection that is capable of at least 10x that isn't particularly remarkable.

[Markymark]

I appreciate that, my point was simply that getting 64kbps performance from a connection that is capable of at least 10x that isn't particularly remarkable.

Oh, I certainly don't deny that, but the contention issue is why broadcasters (and other businesses) have clung to ISDN for longer than might seem logical

[i.h]

It's pretty magic that they can send such good quality video and audio just via home broadband or 4G. No need for ISDN or "Music Circuits" from BT (for radio).

I don't think it's that remarkable, certainly for audio - ISDN is 64kbps, the modern 4G connection won't break a sweat to deliver that kind of speed.

There is the factor that ISDN is 'non contended', you are guaranteed that 64kb/s connection regardless. Domestic 4G or broadband is not, the available bandwidth is not guaranteed, and IP by its nature is a 'fire and forget' transmission system.

Contention isn't the factor that it once was though - most networks (especially in the fixed line world) are vastly over specced anyway. With "domestic" connections you're more likely to run into issues with devices in the home sharing it, or where people insist on using wifi where it isn't suitable & a wired connection would solve the problem. Even if the broadcasters arranged for a bog standard broadband line to be dedicated for the broadcast kit, that could likely work well.

If the budget is there then they could move to "ethernet in the first mile" systems with lower or no contention. I think Openreach has a product that is based on the FTTC network? (which by definition is quicker/cheaper to install)

[Lewis]

It's all a lot less complicated too, as there doesn't have to be an ISDN line, and the existing internet connection can be used. (Or one of those magic 4G boxes)

[VampMix]

https://www.facebook.com/watch/?ref=exte...6313533852

Here's a setup from Channel 5 news, nice plug for the liveu unit

[ElMarko]

Is that an SLR camera? 0_o

[News Engineer]

Contention isn't the factor that it once was though - most networks (especially in the fixed line world) are vastly over specced anyway. With "domestic" connections you're more likely to run into issues with devices in the home sharing it, or where people insist on using wifi where it isn't suitable & a wired connection would solve the problem. Even if the broadcasters arranged for a bog standard broadband line to be dedicated for the broadcast kit, that could likely work well.

You'd think so, yet long before the pandemic - when radio contributions over IP from home were as common place as TV ones have been in the past year - one particular ISP became notorious for correspondents falling off air. Even over ethernet with little / nothing else on their connection, and many many time the bandwidth required. This was helped by putting in a separate router and having the ISP supplied one just acting as a modem, but even on a stable connection, if you looked at the stats on the codec you'd see some packet loss.

For radio in particular, it's not the bandwidth that is the problem. It's jitter that causes the most issues. That was the real battle- trying to get low enough stable latency for a two way conversation.

With video the encoding / decoding delays mean it isn't as much of an issue. Plus a two second delay is acceptable on TV, where as on radio it's an age.

[News Engineer]

I think you will find it is this
https://inqualitymedia.com

It is sometimes, but in in that instance Rory is using a BBC system they developed internally.

Not sure about that one, but a lot are now based around WebRTC with Opus coding for the audio.

[thegeek]

Here's Jake Humphrey's setup from last year:
https://twitter.com/mrjakehumphrey/statu...0603350017

(Plus bonus video)

Sony camera, plus PTZ head and return video on a couple of laptops.

[ElMarko]

Having a multiview is very nice

[i.h]

Contention isn't the factor that it once was though - most networks (especially in the fixed line world) are vastly over specced anyway. With "domestic" connections you're more likely to run into issues with devices in the home sharing it, or where people insist on using wifi where it isn't suitable & a wired connection would solve the problem. Even if the broadcasters arranged for a bog standard broadband line to be dedicated for the broadcast kit, that could likely work well.

You'd think so, yet long before the pandemic - when radio contributions over IP from home were as common place as TV ones have been in the past year - one particular ISP became notorious for correspondents falling off air. Even over ethernet with little / nothing else on their connection, and many many time the bandwidth required. This was helped by putting in a separate router and having the ISP supplied one just acting as a modem, but even on a stable connection, if you looked at the stats on the codec you'd see some packet loss.

For radio in particular, it's not the bandwidth that is the problem. It's jitter that causes the most issues. That was the real battle- trying to get low enough stable latency for a two way conversation.

With video the encoding / decoding delays mean it isn't as much of an issue. Plus a two second delay is acceptable on TV, where as on radio it's an age.

I can absolutely believe that there are certain ISPs (I'm guessing it's those that always go on about their low prices) that wouldn't be up to snuff. Other ISPs care a bit more - especially those who have fingers in a lot of pies and whose core networks are expected to carry the traffic of some Very Discerning Customers Indeed.

With the slow move away from analogue landlines to ISP supplied VoIP I would expect other ISPs to suddenly take more of an interest.

Certainly a potential business opportunity for an ISP to provide a line with the necessary QoS. Especially for the telco that has a large tower, or the TV company and ISP that wants us to Believe in Better...

I wonder if any of the telephone codecs would help? EVS (as used by the VoLTE version of HD Voice) claims to be rather good at concealing network issues, and by definition it can't impose much of a delay. Whether it's good enough for broadcast use I wouldn't like to say