Linguistics and TV

[Kunst]

Some accents are becoming less distinctive and somehow merging or becoming less strong, that's the case for northern English accents, which are becoming "generic northern" (a mixture of Leeds and Manchester) in urban areas, among educated people.
Similar to how Estuary English has been taking over the south-east

The West Country, in the same vein, has been losing some typical features, stigmatized features, especially Bristol, especially when it comes to rhoticity.
Similar story for the West Midlands, to an extent

So probably showing the typical accents of each area, isn't going to reflect the reality of 2022, I believe, unless for some "comic" effects

That could be extended to its own thread - linguistics and TV.
That's my field, so I might even help!

In short, TV, especially in England, has been smoothening regional accent for a rather long time now.
This hasn't led to loss of regional accents, but some accents definitely have become much milder as a consequence, or even beginning to merge, continuing a long established tradition from the south-east (the power of London, its commuters and also its new towns like Milton Keynes in all the south-east bar Norfolk, for now: see Estuary English).

That's the particular case of the south-west, most of it (to an average hasty viewer, there might be little to no difference compared to the south-east these days), where rhoticity (the American-like pronunciation of spelled R, as caR, terroR), the most typical West Country trait, is beginning to be considered as a "broad" one.

Regional BBC/ITV stations have clearly regional newsreaders and so on, and they often sound "milder" than some continuity announcers, representing the "true" reality of 2022.

The nations resist "better", of course, but even there, a pan-regional norm (or pan-national) norm has been created.

[johnnyboy]

Linguistics graduate and full-time copywriter for whom language is a passion so this is a topic of interest to me too.

I think, like you, that, as telecommunications have improved and broadened so much in the last 50 years, that those with a stronger regional accent soften them (and use fewer regional words) in an effort to be better understood.

I recently finished watching Clarkson's Farm on Prime Video.

The "head of security" Gerald and Kaleb come from the same part of the world but Kaleb's accent is much softer despite being such a local bloke also. I'm not sure how much can be put down to Gerald's lack of exposure/Kaleb's greater exposure to accents via the media but I would imagine it's a factor.

Ant and Dec have the two main "Geordie" accents, for example, and they wear their Geordieness with pride. But I doubt some of the stronger accents you hear in North Shields (for example, Sam Spender) would be heard as presenters rather than guests.

Language and how we express ourselves change over time. I love the regionality of British accents and I hope we retain it for a long time to come.

[Kunst]

If you're into phonetics and understand some IPA symbols (although these are extended: canIPA, from his creator and a friend of mine, Luciano Canepari), has been describing some mediatic regional accents of Britain, and also partly the US, where a similar phenomenon of smoothening is happening, which is happening in almost all nations.

https://canipa.net/lib/exe/fetch.php?med...g_2021.pdf northern England
https://canipa.net/lib/exe/fetch.php?med...d_celt.pdf "Celtic" nations
https://canipa.net/lib/exe/fetch.php?med...ng_acc.pdf Further
(the content is free of charge)

So yeah, northern England in particular is documented.

I don't think the UK is going to lose all the differences, as regional accents are a kind of "social pride", but I see the situation similar to my one in Italy, the accents are getting milder, especially on the telly and also on regional channels.

Of course, TV doesn't change one's accent, but it definitely makes you more easily prone to comparisons with the "outsiders".

Younger people all around England, and partly even Wales (where Cardiff tends to be the prime influence), also tend to acquire somehow more southeastern traits, especially for consonants.

[johnnyboy]

If you're into phonetics and understand some IPA symbols (although these are extended: canIPA, from his creator and a friend of mine, Luciano Canepari), has been describing some mediatic regional accents of Britain, and also partly the US, where a similar phenomenon of smoothening is happening, which is happening in almost all nations.

https://canipa.net/lib/exe/fetch.php?med...g_2021.pdf northern England
https://canipa.net/lib/exe/fetch.php?med...d_celt.pdf "Celtic" nations
https://canipa.net/lib/exe/fetch.php?med...ng_acc.pdf Further
(the content is free of charge)

So yeah, northern England in particular is documented.

I don't think the UK is going to lose all the differences, as regional accents are a kind of "social pride", but I see the situation similar to my one in Italy, the accents are getting milder, especially on the telly and also on regional channels.

Of course, TV doesn't change one's accent, but it definitely makes you more easily prone to comparisons with the "outsiders".

Younger people all around England, and partly even Wales (where Cardiff tends to be the prime influence), also tend to acquire somehow more southeastern traits, especially for consonants.

Aaah...phonetics was the hardest part of my degree. I still get the shakes when I think about it!!!

I have heard a few Geordies use "innit" in recent times and it's definitely not a native Geordie expression.

I didn't realise you were Italian, Kunst. Just done a quick search on "accents in Italy" and I was surprised to find that there are as many dialects as there are. How easy do you find it to understand fellow countrymen and women from different parts of Italy? I have a good ear for accents but, to go back to Clarkson's Farm, I just couldn't understand much of what Gerald was saying.

There seems to be a good variety of older languages still in use in your country too similar to Scottish Gaelic and Welsh here in Britain.

[Kunst]

Dialects in Italy are different "languages", we call them dialects because of a political definition, although for the central linguistic area of Italy calling them dialects is correct (Tuscany, Umbria, central-southern Marches, Latium and even Corsica/northern Sardinian), since there dialects are directly related to the Italian language, same substratum, sort of like England for the UK, so dialects are less different to standard Italian, since standard Italian is based on a "smoothened" and literate Florentine dialect, at least historically.
Currently it has interferences and influences from Rome.

Then you have different "languages", like Lombard, Venetian, Friulan, Campanian, Apulian, Sicilian, Sardinian etc. with many internal subdivisions, sort of like Lowland Scottish areas have some sub-accents
And obviously South Tyrolean dialect is a southern German dialect!

But we mostly communicate in standard Italian with each other, but with different accents, so there's no risk of misunderstanding , for the most part; Rome (for the central areas and to a certain extent the south), and Milan (for the north) are two sort of more prestigious accent, but there's no other prestigious accent like standard Italian as uttered by dubbers

Here people think (or used to think) of "wrong" Italian with a regional accent, standard Italian (neutral accent) is what dubbers, some journalists and some professional environments require, although, even on the telly by reporters, it's not infrequent to hear "mediatic pronunciations" (regional accents with milder features, with a sort of special prestige compared to real regional pronunciations), similar to the UK.

So much some people even go on defending them, since it requires much less effort, compared to our "RP" standard.

I like phonetics, but I realise it's not everyone's taste

[Kunst]

Add to that the fact that "dialects", especially in the north where they're further away from standard Italian, but not only there, are disappearing or being more restricted to certain lower class environments, because of media being in Italian, and so on.

Sort of like real Mancunian, real Yorkshire (whether North, or West/South and East) "dialects" etc. have disappeared, and especially Scots.

They're becoming a folklore thing these days, although some areas resist better than others (like Veneto).

But regional accents tend to remain, although broad accents definitely have a negative connotations in our society

[Humphrey Hacker]

This might be an urban myth but apparently Australian soaps have caused many Australians to end what they're saying with an uplift in their voice.

[johnnyboy]

This might be an urban myth but apparently Australian soaps have caused many Australians to end what they're saying with an uplift in their voice.

I have a clear memory of Phil Schofield in the broom cupboard explaining the origins of "See you later".

I seem to recall he said something like "see you later" was a New Zealand expression for "goodbye" which he continued to use when he got back to the UK.

I continue to use that expression to today even if I know I'm not going to actually physically see the person at a known future point. I have wondered since whether "see you later" was used in the UK in the way that Phil explained before he started using it on TV.

It's amazing what sticks with you for 35 years. Probs a false memory :-)

[Humphrey Hacker]

This might be an urban myth but apparently Australian soaps have caused many Australians to end what they're saying with an uplift in their voice.

I have a clear memory of Phil Schofield in the broom cupboard explaining the origins of "See you later".

I seem to recall he said something like "see you later" was a New Zealand expression for "goodbye" which he continued to use when he got back to the UK.

I continue to use that expression to today even if I know I'm not going to actually physically see the person at a known future point. I have wondered since whether "see you later" was used in the UK in the way that Phil explained before he started using it on TV.

It's amazing what sticks with you for 35 years. Probs a false memory :-)

This may help
https://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/See+you+later

[Blubatt]

You should come to Liverpool. I swear our accent is getting thicker by the day.

[Humphrey Hacker]

And Yorkshire. I swear whenever Calendar or Look North interview anyone from South Yorkshire they pick people with the thickest accents.