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BBC - how does it fight back? - johnnyboy - 07-07-2021
TVLF comrades, most of us love and support the BBC but it's in trouble.
Opting out of the licence fee seems to be accelerating (although some of that may be offset by the creation of new homes and dwellings to an extent).
In today's Times, Julian Knight, Conservative chairman of the Commons media select committee, said it was “clear the BBC is haemorrhaging support amongst a significant proportion of the British public...(I)f this trend continues, (it) could soon reach vanishing point where evasion is so widespread as to undermine faith in the TV licence system. This is fast becoming a crisis for the BBC.”
I have to agree with him.
A couple of friends of mine have stopped paying the licence fee. I have had discussions with them explaining why I think the BBC is so valuable to our cohesiveness as a nation and our soft power as a country abroad.
I would personally never stop paying the licence fee as, because there is much I dislike about the BBC, that is far outweighed by what I love about it.
So how does the BBC fight back?
If I were in charge, I would petititon the Government to sell off the radio bandwidth (including local radio) which could be catered for by commercial rivals (leaving perhaps Radio 4). As well as the one-off income boost, there would be savings of hundreds of millions of pounds per year which could then be reinvested into programming.
I would scrap BBC3 and, as much as it pains me to say in, BBC4 to free up another £100m for the type of content I describe at the end of this post. BBC Alba and S4C should be protected imo because they are indigineous minority languages crucial to the identities of their speakers and both are under threat, especially Scottish Gaelic, but I would lobby the Welsh and Scottish governments for more assistance.
Does the BBC really need to spend £350m pa on news and £100m on its online services? Could there be a cull in these departments without diminishing quality too much? Could another £150-£200m be saved from these departments?
With these actions, the BBC would save hundreds of millions of pounds per year.
I would then focus on investment in content on BBC1, 2, Cbeebies, and CBBC. I would then try to create brands for example on iPlayer where people within given demographics are more likely to easily find the content they want.
It's amazing how much we rave about the BBC for stuff like Line of Duty, Life on Mars, and event/appointment to view type programming. Let's hit the public with one new brilliant thing a week which is quality, distinctive, and unmissable.
Because, when it boils down to its essense, the BBC is loved and respected for its content. And I think that's where it has the best chance of making it relevant 100 years after its formation.
MODS - I didn't know which forum to put this in - please shift if you think fit.
BBC - how does it fight back? - all new Phil - 07-07-2021
Not much I disagree with here. The argument is too often framed as you’re either for the BBC or you’re against it, but it sounds that you believe, like me, that the BBC needs to exist but needs to be rationalised.
I’ve argued in the past that what I’d like to see is a thorough review of what content the BBC does and should create, and then work backwards to figure out how many channels that actually fills. Too often though you get excuses as to why things can’t happen - my gut feeling is you’d probably fit all new content (excluding kids but including all news) onto 2 channels.
BBC - how does it fight back? - AllWillBeWell - 07-07-2021
As much as the government is going to kick and scream about the license fee, I am starting to think they are going to kick it down the road, and as far as they will go is decriminalise non payment.
Knight says the BBC is losing so much support, what measure is he using to determine this? I can see from the annual report yesterday the the BBC has lost one million licenses over the past year but still generates 3.75 billion from the 24.8 million licenses still active. Last year it was 3.5 billion so they actually made more this year, excluding inflation of course.
https://www.tvlicensing.co.uk/about/our-performance-AB6
I think most people will still pay and support The BBC, the question is how money can it lose before its future is in trouble. I did see online how in BBC Scotland they are beginning to move some studio control from public to private. Perhaps this will happen across the board slowly in preparation to make more revenue from the private side to make up for what is lost on the public side. BBC Studios is hitting its targets.
Dominic Cummings had a master plan to sell off nearly every BBC radio, that fizzled out even before he went. But I certainly agree The BBC has too many radio stations and they seem to be treated like the stars of The BBC when really they are not. Radio has too much power within the corporation, which at times slows the rest of the place down and puts obstacles in the way of future development.
Scrapping channels I don't agree with because it is peanuts in savings and for the moment it is beneficial for the channels to exist in order for The BBC to reach everyone, but some day digital streaming will be king and The BBC will have to pull the plug. Maybe in another 10/15 years, probably 20. I think at least one channel will always exist, BBC News for example but how we receive it will change.
The BBC has already made cuts to News recently and Online in the past. This are two of the major parts of The BBC, online spending should increase because that is the future. News is still behind with the times and needs an even bigger shake up, which perhaps may come soon with the merging of teams and roles which is happening, but even then I feel it needs to be modernised even more.
The DG has recently stated The BBC cannot compete with the streaming giants and it should no longer try to, I think this is the right approach. They should continue to produce content and like even with streamers, they will get a hit every now and then.
I said some time ago in the old place that The BBC wasted too much money and should be ripped apart, gutted and put back together. My views have changed since then and I will think it does waste money in places, but there are lots of good parts which just need to be modernised but certainly not gutted. But radio on the other hand still needs to be looked at because as I say it seems to be protected in some form from greater shakeups, not that it should be gutted, but big parts of it need to be cut away to focus just on the good stuff. Many in the industry as a whole still think they are "working in tv/radio" and are somehow in the magic days of the past, that boat has sailed, those days are over. Reality is here and if those between the top and bottom do not accept that, some of them have, but not all, then the BBC's issues will only increase. Not just at The BBC either. Other broadcasters also. But there adjustment is quicker for obvious reasons.
BBC - how does it fight back? - caseyref - 07-07-2021
It's a really unpopular opinion but I think we need to move to a Taxable system where every person contributes towards the BBC. This may enable the licence fee to reduce for everyone rather than a smaller pool of people paying more each year. NRK and SVT in Norway and Sweden operate in this way since funding changes last year.
At the moment I think a large number of people across the UK from many age groups believe that if you watch TV or programmes on iPlayer via your TV or tablet you won't need a licence fee. This means so many people are watching the best of the BBC for free.
If taxation isn't possible or popular then the BBC need to sure up the iPlayer and as part of the sign up process to access iPlayer, you need to enter your TV licence number and household address for the content.
Re channels, I do think that BBC Four should be the prime candidate for closure and the content merged with BBC Two. BBC Three should continue to be launched as a channel but focus on youth market and live events.
Dare I say it but BBC Scotland should close and BBC One Scotland have a special identity and increased levels of Scottish programming. This way you give the Scottish audiences a strong channel identity on the first channel in the EPG, the best of local programming and the best of the BBC One network. This could be replicated for BBC Wales, BBC NI and BBC North.
Finally if we are being really radical, could we have BBC One Two, CBBC and CBeebies as the non advertising channels and BBC Knowledge and BBC Choice as advertising funded channels that run 24/7 with their own self funded BBC Studio content. I know UKTV is there for that purpose but if the public saw a BBC with half advertising funded and half public funded they may see the service as better value.
BBC - how does it fight back? - Keith - 07-07-2021
caseyref post_id=26301 time= user_id=734 Wrote:It's a really unpopular opinion but I think we need to move to a Taxable system where every person contributes towards the BBC. This may enable the licence fee to reduce for everyone rather than a smaller pool of people paying more each year. NRK and SVT in Norway and Sweden operate in this way since funding changes last year.A similar method might be for the licence fee to be taken for residential users via the council tax. The single person occupancy rules etc could also apply to the licence fee, meaning that those eligible for the council tax discount would pay less towards their licence fee. I imagine it might result in more people paying, which has the potential for a lower or frozen fee per household. Where this method presumably wouldn't work is with businesses, which would have to use either the existing or alternative method to pay for TV licence(s).
At the moment I think a large number of people across the UK from many age groups believe that if you watch TV or programmes on iPlayer via your TV or tablet you won't need a licence fee. This means so many people are watching the best of the BBC for free.
If taxation isn't possible or popular then the BBC need to sure up the iPlayer and as part of the sign up process to access iPlayer, you need to enter your TV licence number and household address for the content.
It's also worth noting that as of 31st March this year 4450 black and white TV licences were apparently still in force, according to https://www.tvlicensing.co.uk/about/foi-licences-facts-and-figures-AB18. Surely in 2021 there's a strong case for increase the cost of a mono licence from £53.50, considering a normal licence is now £159.
BBC - how does it fight back? - AllWillBeWell - 07-07-2021
If they are changing it, it needs to become voluntary, any system that “forces” you to pay for it will not end well.
I don’t think they need to change it yet, they could probably get away with another period of the license, but after it should be a subscription model without question. There is no way the public would accept moving to a non voluntary one. The current one is pretty non voluntary already, hardly an improvement to move to another one. Any type of method which involves taxes, or the council, or government, is not a solution. It has to be pay monthly or yearly like a subscription service would be, which can be cancelled at any time. And specifically for BBC content, you should not need it to just watch a tv.
BBC - how does it fight back? - Humphrey Hacker - 07-07-2021
The BBC is a deeply flawed organisation in so many ways and many people are expressing their disgust and anger by canceling their licence fees. I was very supportive of them in the old place about how they covered the pandemic and in many ways that hasn't changed but with as we know there have been revelations that have altered people's perceptions.
It's my belief that the BBC have gone for Quantity over quality in their channels. BBC 4 does show some good programmes with "Timeshift" being one of the best but most of what they show has been available for years elsewhere and is a waste of bandwidth. I never watched much of BBC 3 when it was a. "normal" channel and with BBC News I have to ask is it value for money? I have to answer no.
So what can be done? Well I have my own ideas and they will kick up a stink but here goes.
1. Scrap BBC 3 and 4 as regular channels and make them streaming only.
2. Scrap all BBC radio stations except BBC radio 4 and reformat it as a National Network with local optouts at specific times.
3. Scrap BBC News and BBC 2 and merge them with BBC1. Create a national channel with legally imposed local blocks of programming at specific times and have "BBC Television" as the "best of British"
4. Create a "BBC Sports Network" and have it on one of the slots left by BBC 3 /4
5. Merge CBBC and Cbeebies
6. Keep the regional TV and Radio stations and place them under the control of Glasgow, Belfast and Cardiff effectively making them "independent" of London.
Entertainment, news, sports, children's and the regions would be the core elements of the " new BBC" whilst still having access to the archive.
BBC - how does it fight back? - Brekkie - 07-07-2021
Politicians not undermining it at every opportunity would be a start. The BBC needs defending, not defunding, and axing services is not the answer. You only have to look at the disastrous Local TV network to see if BBC services go the commercial sector doesn't plug the gap, whilst commercial radio has now pretty much lost all it's local identity. Removing channels or services just exasperates the problem rather than solves it and one person's BBC Asian Network is another's BBC Radio 4. Personally I listen to neither but that doesn't mean I think they don't have the right to exist.
The last week alone has shown the value of the BBC and I suspect many shouting loudest about defunding it will also be those complaining tonight's match is on ITV rather than the BBC.
BBC - how does it fight back? - TheMightyTRex - 07-07-2021
It was always going to be thus.... but this thread has some of the usual "I don't watch it / listen therefore its rubbish and has no use and should be closed right now! " attitude you get everywhere when talking about the BBC. No thought for others and their needs.
BBC - how does it fight back? - AxiosBrit67 - 07-07-2021
Humphrey Hacker post_id=26309 time= user_id=1128 Wrote:The BBC is a deeply flawed organisation in so many ways and many people are expressing their disgust and anger by canceling their licence fees. I was very supportive of them in the old place about how they covered the pandemic and in many ways that hasn't changed but with as we know there have been revelations that have altered people's perceptions.
It's my belief that the BBC have gone for Quantity over quality in their channels. BBC 4 does show some good programmes with "Timeshift" being one of the best but most of what they show has been available for years elsewhere and is a waste of bandwidth. I never watched much of BBC 3 when it was a. "normal" channel and with BBC News I have to ask is it value for money? I have to answer no.
So what can be done? Well I have my own ideas and they will kick up a stink but here goes.
1. Scrap BBC 3 and 4 as regular channels and make them streaming only.
2. Scrap all BBC radio stations except BBC radio 4 and reformat it as a National Network with local optouts at specific times.
3. Scrap BBC News and BBC 2 and merge them with BBC1. Create a national channel with legally imposed local blocks of programming at specific times and have "BBC Television" as the "best of British"
4. Create a "BBC Sports Network" and have it on one of the slots left by BBC 3 /4
5. Merge CBBC and Cbeebies
6. Keep the regional TV and Radio stations and place them under the control of Glasgow, Belfast and Cardiff effectively making them "independent" of London.
Entertainment, news, sports, children's and the regions would be the core elements of the " new BBC" whilst still having access to the archive.
I have a more radical vision for the BBC. one way is to turn the BBC into a commercial broadcaster and divide the network as O&O like the system that NBC, CBS, and ABC have in the US. In addition, i want to create affiliate channels for the BBC which is more akin to the US networks.
BBC - how does it fight back? - TheMightyTRex - 07-07-2021
AxiosBrit67 post_id=26317 time= user_id=1688 Wrote:Humphrey Hacker post_id=26309 time= user_id=1128 Wrote:The BBC is a deeply flawed organisation in so many ways and many people are expressing their disgust and anger by canceling their licence fees. I was very supportive of them in the old place about how they covered the pandemic and in many ways that hasn't changed but with as we know there have been revelations that have altered people's perceptions.
It's my belief that the BBC have gone for Quantity over quality in their channels. BBC 4 does show some good programmes with "Timeshift" being one of the best but most of what they show has been available for years elsewhere and is a waste of bandwidth. I never watched much of BBC 3 when it was a. "normal" channel and with BBC News I have to ask is it value for money? I have to answer no.
So what can be done? Well I have my own ideas and they will kick up a stink but here goes.
1. Scrap BBC 3 and 4 as regular channels and make them streaming only.
2. Scrap all BBC radio stations except BBC radio 4 and reformat it as a National Network with local optouts at specific times.
3. Scrap BBC News and BBC 2 and merge them with BBC1. Create a national channel with legally imposed local blocks of programming at specific times and have "BBC Television" as the "best of British"
4. Create a "BBC Sports Network" and have it on one of the slots left by BBC 3 /4
5. Merge CBBC and Cbeebies
6. Keep the regional TV and Radio stations and place them under the control of Glasgow, Belfast and Cardiff effectively making them "independent" of London.
Entertainment, news, sports, children's and the regions would be the core elements of the " new BBC" whilst still having access to the archive.
I have a more radical vision for the BBC. one way is to turn the BBC into a commercial broadcaster and divide the network as O&O like the system that NBC, CBS, and ABC have in the US. In addition, i want to create affiliate channels for the BBC which is more akin to the US networks.
Local TV, Regional ITV... The UK is not big enough for this. Plus a lot of the smaller channels would loose a lot of advertising revenue.
Company x has £100 Million to spend on advertising on TV
Currently its
40% ITV Channels
20% Channel 4 channels
10% Channel 5
25% Main Sky Channels
5% Everything else
Who is to take the cut?
BBC - how does it fight back? - XIII - 07-07-2021
Merging CBBC and CBeebies is not going to happen, they’re like chalk and cheese content wise and it wouldn’t save much. Likewise with merging BBC Two and BBC News with One, ain’t going to happen either
BBC - how does it fight back? - Cassia Tuna - 07-07-2021
Centralise the BBC's local radio output and make BBC Radio 5 Live the backbone of the network, with the local radio stations providing regular opt-outs for local news, traffic, weather and for exceptional circumstances (weather emergencies, industrial disasters, breaking news stories affecting a single area, etc.).
Close the white elephant that is BBC Queen's Gardens, Hull and merge its output with BBC Leeds, while still providing a 5 to 10 minute opt-out for stories affecting E. Yorks and N.E. Lincolnshire. At present there is not enough content to justify a full half-hour programme dedicated to the region.
BBC - how does it fight back? - johnnyboy - 07-07-2021
XIII post_id=26320 time= user_id=894 Wrote:Merging CBBC and CBeebies is not going to happen, they’re like chalk and cheese content wise and it wouldn’t save much. Likewise with merging BBC Two and BBC News with One, ain’t going to happen either
Agreed - my six year old and eight year old have wildly different tastes in programming.
Getting my eldest off CBeebies onto CBBC was difficult enough and I'm having the same problem with my youngest.
BBC - how does it fight back? - johnnyboy - 07-07-2021
Brekkie post_id=26314 time= user_id=976 Wrote:Politicians not undermining it at every opportunity would be a start. The BBC needs defending, not defunding, and axing services is not the answer. You only have to look at the disastrous Local TV network to see if BBC services go the commercial sector doesn't plug the gap, whilst commercial radio has now pretty much lost all it's local identity. Removing channels or services just exasperates the problem rather than solves it and one person's BBC Asian Network is another's BBC Radio 4. Personally I listen to neither but that doesn't mean I think they don't have the right to exist.
The last week alone has shown the value of the BBC and I suspect many shouting loudest about defunding it will also be those complaining tonight's match is on ITV rather than the BBC.
I'm still surprised that the Local TV network was allowed to go ahead - its eventual fate was predicted by many prior to the launch of the first station.
Dissatisfaction with the BBC is not isolated to the right although I do admit that discontent is wider in that part of the population - for now.
However, addressing the growing negative feelings towards it from many different sides rather than dismissing it as the obsession of just one part of the population is likely to be a more successful strategy for defending the BBC.
Just so I'm clear, I didn't call for the BBC to be defunded or to have its operating income reduced. What I proposed was an almost obsessive focus on creating one piece of event television per week among all of its other content so that people would be reminded of its specialness or uniqueness.
The licence fee, to me, is great value for money but it could be so much better with even more amazing content.
There is no need for the BBC to have as many radio stations as it does considering most of them, including the BBC Asian Network, could operate commercially.
I am talking about holding a beauty contest (not a 1991 ITV franchise auction) for the bandwidth compelling minimum levels of content and quality. I am sure that someone will say to me that the commitments for independent radio have already been watered down and you're right. This may well happen by selling the stations to the private sector but we're talking about saving the BBC as a whole.
Unfortunately, you can't make an omelette without breaking eggs.